Re: <nettime> Facebook

[voyd@voyd.com]

Even though it might seem trite, I think that a return to the rhetoric of Barlow's Declaration of Independence of Cyberspace is not the worst idea. In some ways, it could be updated to say that you had your chance; all it has done has subjugated the internet with capitalism and ignorance.  While I don;t expect a grand Digital Spring, nor do I think that the networks de refusees are teh answers either, I feel a much more subtle social shift is in order, and I see the potential of it in the Post-Trump world if we do not let the fragmentation that has compounded itself upon polarization drag everything further into the abyss.

Because there is not cliff to go over, as the situation for me is far stranger than merely going across a line (I.e. cliff)

On Tue, 05 Nov 2019 02:23:36 -0800, tacira@riseup.net wrote:

other social networks are possible

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50127713


Em 2019-11-04 21:29, Alan Sondheim escreveu:
> I'm in agreement here; I leave as little trace as I can. (Also trapped
> because I want my own work to remain.) This reminds me of the fight I
> had on YouTube with Viacom and YouTube (later) re: my banning which
> went on for a couple of years, a fight I finally won. YouTube has its
> own viciousness of course - even something as saying no to autoplay,
> which then returns on the next login.
>
> I'd be curious about the server farms YouTube must use; they seem
> unimaginable to me.
>
> Best, Alan
>
> On Mon, 4 Nov 2019, Craig Fahner wrote:
>
>> maybe it's not so much a question of whether facebook's policies are bad (of
>> course they are) or whether facebook is part of our social infrastructure
>> (of course it is), but, rather, what capacity users have to undermine
>> facebook's more predatory policies and evade its data collection regimes and
>> biased recommendation algorithms. given that a lot of people use facebook
>> not because they think it's an optimal platform, but because it is
>> absolutely necessary to use it in order to connect with certain communities,
>> what possibilities exist for users to participate in those communities while
>> circumventing the platform's more odious aspects? what do a tactics of
>> social media usership look like? i suspect they would engage in a constant
>> give-and-take with the algorithmic governing forces that be, but, with a
>> growing sentiment of suspicion regarding facebook's policies, perhaps a
>> tactical approach along the lines of plugins that remove algorithmic
>> recommendation features, deliberate scrambling/obfuscation of users' data
>> and trackable behaviours, etc. might be more successful in empowering users
>> than simply encouraging them to leave the platform entirely.
>> craig fahner - https://www.craigfahner.com/
>>
>> On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 9:25 AM Alan Sondheim wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Mon, 4 Nov 2019, mp wrote:
>>
>> > On 03/11/2019 20:36, Alan Sondheim wrote:
>> >>
>> >> The loss is more important to me
>> >
>> >> On Sun, 3 Nov 2019, Frederic Neyrat wrote:
>> >>> 1/ FB enables to create a "community," that's good for
>> sure;?
>> >>> 2/ but in the same time, it destroys?the condition of the
>> possibility of
>> >>> community/togetherness/Gemeinwesen/?tre-ensemble, etc.
>> >
>> > Individual, particular and hence relatively short term
>> perspective and
>> > context (Alan's) vs. collective, abstract and hence relatively
>> long term
>> > perspective and context (Frederic's).
>> >
>> > A common disjuncture.
>> >
>>
>> What disturbs me here is the assumption of passivity "relatively
>> short
>> term perspective" for example. Unless you know my work, read my
>> posts,
>> etc., you have no idea how long my perspective is. I've run
>> talkers, a
>> MOO, conferencing in IRC years ago, CuSeeMe, and on and on. I've
>> taught
>> courses in internet culture from 1995 on. And one of the things
>> that keeps
>> me generally from posting on nettime, is its own toxicity, these
>> constant
>> presumptions about one another, about the world, etc. And re:
>> below, there
>> is no "on the one hand, on the other hand" - the issue is far
>> more complex
>> as is people's usage of Fb or other platforms (for example email
>> lists
>> themselves). So "email is also shit"?
>>
>> I know a hell of a lot of free jazz musicians who work through
>> Fb, fight
>> racism, and take advantage of the platform. I know people who
>> have found
>> community on Fb that is absent for them in rl. I've participated
>> in
>> courses taught on Fb. I've engaged in political action on the
>> platform. I
>> don't expect purity anywhere; I never have. And one person's
>> purity can be
>> another person's hell. I'm appalled at Fb's policies but also
>> given that
>> the platform has between 1 and 2.4 billion users, the sociality
>> is far
>> greater (and far more diverse and interesting) than its public
>> image.
>>
>> Alan
>>
>>
>> > It is a complex issue. On the one hand it makes sense to
>> adjust your
>> > means to the ends you desire. Be the change you want to see
>> and all that.
>> >
>> > On the other hand, it could be seen as a form of
>> neoliberalisation when
>> > the responsibility for the future of the system is distributed
>> to
>> > individuals - and at the end of the day, it is impossible to
>> live in
>> > this planetary urbanisation without acting in destructive
>> ways, so we
>> > all have to cut corners. Email is also shit for the web of
>> life we are
>> > entangled in.
>>
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>
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