| Sean Cubitt on Fri, 12 Jan 2018 12:33:26 +0100 (CET) |
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| Re: <nettime> Speculative Intergalactic Network |
would it be more useful/interesting to establish communication with planet Earth? “If a lion would speak, we would not be able to understand it” (Wittgenstein) but it is clear that lions (rivers, forests, oceans, reefs, animals etc) do speak; but that we refuse to listen. Nowhere in the galaxy is more observed by humans than this one yet we are not understanding what we see and hear (across multiple spectra) - at least in the sense that the only evidence of understanding would be taking action on what we learn from what the panet is saying. But to go back to the SETI thought experiment. The one thing we can be sure of is that comms with aliens will be slow: light years intervene. So we need to survive in order to have a dialogue. Since we are ecologically-implicated creatures, we may need to establish a working planet in the ruins of this one if we are going to have a chat with the Greys. I see us as naughty teenagers being told by our new interlocutors “Clean up your room. Then you can play on intergalactic social media” sean > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2018 20:17:37 +0100 > From: K E N O <lucky@kenokeno.bingo> > To: christineT <christine.T@no-log.org>, nettime-l@kein.org > Subject: Re: <nettime> Speculative Intergalactic Network > Message-ID: <B48BDD30-FF1B-4C53-8336-2E80D1415CFC@kenokeno.bingo> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > >> It would probably not be called internet, require a better >> understanding and use of our "other senses and sensors". >> Maybe it exists and we dumbs don't perceive it... or we don't know that >> certain waves effects are signs of it... or we produce too much >> electromagnetic pollution to be able to catch it, or? > > ? or they are already using gravitational waves for communication. ;) Or some other kind of transmission medium. Or they exist in another dimension. That would be nice: an intergalactic and multi-dimensional internet. What would intergalactic internet memes be like? > Electromagnetic pollution is an interesting point, since we love (I do, for sure) our electromagnetic communication and broadcasting systems. Nevertheless, we only focus on pollution regarding the spectrum of light because we can see it. > That leads to the SETI initiative, which I find very interesting from both a scientific and an artistic view. Analysing electromagnetic signals, they are not only able to discover extraterrestrial life, but also to detect other cosmological events. It?s like fundamental research of electromagnetic signals with a chance of finding aliens. > >> For the first amateur radio satellite, they could call it Loretta Strong >> ( from Copi's theater play) or Walt Dangerfield (from P. K. Dick's Dr >> Bloodmoney). I think that should enable a better communication to/with >> space, cause they are intergalactically known and explicit, nope ? > > They do call it Fox-1D. ;) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMSAT#Satellite_names <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMSAT#Satellite_names>. > > K E N O > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: <http://mx.kein.org/pipermail/nettime-l/attachments/20180111/b3c01340/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2018 21:16:00 +0100 > From: Keith Hart <keith@thememorybank.co.uk> > To: nettime <nettime-l@kein.org> > Subject: Re: <nettime> Speculative Intergalactic Network > Message-ID: > <CAF32U9E4T5gyO08c6Xx64hx2JtgJHUktgfEf86ynDoKbT6UFJQ@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > As a thought experiment, consider why we can't communicate with the ants > or vice versa. Their social organization is stronger than ours and their > collective intelligence is demonstrable. It may be that one side is more > primitive than the other. But which? > > Kant held that reason is still largely individual in the human case and its > potential will only be realized at the species level. He didn't mean that > we all become one big brain, but rather that we have to learn to pool our > intelligence and knowledge more effectively than at present. He probably > had in mind libraries to which we could add mass media (which are usually > one-way) and now the internet where everyone in principle can be a producer > and consumer, but it would seem that the organization of collective reason > is far away. > > Kant also asked if our mathematics were universal and might therefore be a > means of communicating with aliens; and rejected the idea. His Copernican > revolution in metaphysics led him to make this observation: "Hitherto our > knowledge has conformed to objects; but what if objects have to conform to > our knowledge?" Our mathematics, music etc are therefore culturally > specific and would not allow us to communicate with aliens. But hang in > there, maybe, if we don't destroy the planet first, we might get there as a > species one day. Think again, Steven Spielberg. > > The digital revolution is the most important in human history since the > invention of agriculture, but we are the digging stick operators in that > revolution and they couldn't have a clue that it all ends up as Chinese > civilization. > > Alternatively we and the other inhabitants of this planet may already be > the objects of a computer game played by much more intelligent aliens. It > is absurd to imagine that our pathetic technologies and even more pathetic > societies could expand our current means of communication to reach > extraterrestrials, any more than the ants already have the means to reach > us or the other way round. The Victorian thought they were the last stage > of evolution. We need to be more modest. > > Keith > > On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 5:00 PM, christineT <christine.T@no-log.org> wrote: > >> I very much like the idea of a communication network expanded to aliens >> (us included) >> >>> Let?s assume (so called intelligent) aliens would exist. What do you >> think: How would communication work with those aliens? How would it change >> the Internet if we expanded it to different planets? I?ve been wondering if >> hierarchical structures between the new lifeforms and us humans would occur >> ? like a new form of imperialism. >>> >> # distributed via <nettime>: no commercial use without permission >> # <nettime> is a moderated mailing list for net criticism, >> # collaborative text filtering and cultural politics of the nets >> # more info: http://mx.kein.org/mailman/listinfo/nettime-l >> # archive: http://www.nettime.org contact: nettime@kein.org >> # @nettime_bot tweets mail w/ sender unless #ANON is in Subject: >> > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: <http://mx.kein.org/pipermail/nettime-l/attachments/20180111/d54dd865/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2018 17:59:11 -0700 > From: John Hopkins <jhopkins@neoscenes.net> > To: christineT <christine.T@no-log.org>, K E N O > <lucky@kenokeno.bingo>, nettime-l@kein.org > Subject: Re: <nettime> Speculative Intergalactic Network > Message-ID: <48cee7f2-70d9-f019-9cc6-b9eb8c5a3d39@neoscenes.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > Keith - you beat me to it -- > > There is much room for expanding ones communicative system in the immediate > surrounds of this very planet -- there is an abundance of communicative energy > flows all around us. Most of these we are -- by choice and by social convention > -- completely ignoring. Yet we possess the faculties to tap into them 'merely' > by paying attention ... both to our body-system and to the rest of the systems > we are but a small part of... > > If only as a mental exercise, it can be cleansing of the mind to move into some > environment, preferably one with some shred of 'naturalness' remaining, and > 'unknow' what you observe in it. You will see alien worlds at your fingertips. > > Indeed, if you consider communication to be the directed/organized flow of > energy, the concepts of primitive or advanced need to be considered both in end > effect on the transmitter and receiver, as well as the overall effect of the > communicative act on everything around it. I suspect that primitive/advanced > have no meaning in that regard! DNA signaling or pheromones being just as > profound as Kant ... and ultimately far more potent ... > > JH > > On 11/Jan/18 09:00, christineT wrote: >> I very much like the idea of a communication network expanded to aliens >> (us included) and the question of imperialistic subordination of ones by >> others. It would probably not be called internet, require a better >> understanding and use of our "other senses and sensors". >> Maybe it exists and we dumbs don't perceive it... or we don't know that >> certain waves effects are signs of it... or we produce too much >> electromagnetic pollution to be able to catch it, or... > > > -- > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Dr. John Hopkins, BSc, MFA, PhD > hanging on to the Laramide Orogeny > twitter: @neoscenes > http://tech-no-mad.net/blog/ > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > ------------------------------ > > # distributed via <nettime>: no commercial use without permission > # <nettime> is a moderated mailing list for net criticism, > # collaborative text filtering and cultural politics of the nets > # more info: http://mx.kein.org/mailman/listinfo/nettime-l > > End of nettime-l Digest, Vol 124, Issue 14 > ****************************************** # distributed via <nettime>: no commercial use without permission # <nettime> is a moderated mailing list for net criticism, # collaborative text filtering and cultural politics of the nets # more info: http://mx.kein.org/mailman/listinfo/nettime-l # archive: http://www.nettime.org contact: nettime@kein.org # @nettime_bot tweets mail w/ sender unless #ANON is in Subject: