[Nettime-bold] Re: <nettime> Should Open SOurce Developers help the US prepare forWar..???!

[adam <adam@xs4all.nl>]

this is a really interesting idea, its seems to me somehow similar to
the 'no hate language' clause that many apply informally to limiting
freedom of speech...


a 'not for military use' clause as part of the GPL?

hmmm...a double edged sword....

adam


On Thu, 27 Feb 2003, . __ . wrote:

>
> The idea is somehow absurd... but in the end it is open source, which
> means that anybody should be allowed to use it... this is an important
> regulative process for "official" power and helps keep the balance... even
> if I can understand the problems with cryptographic software, like with
> PGP, as pointed out in the article...
>
> But in the end, if we abolish all the rights which are the fundament of
> democracy, especially the privacy laws, then the terrorists would have won
> anyway...
>
> What do you think?!
>
> Cheers,
>
> g
>
>
>
> ****
>
> http://newsforge.com/newsforge/03/02/25/195228.shtml?tid=4
>
> - By <http://roblimo.com>Robin 'Roblimo' Miller -
>
> This article is based on an IRC interview with Anthony L. Awtrey, vice
> president of <http://idealcorp.com/>I.D.E.A.L. Technology, who has worked
> on some of the (Open Source-based) simulation software used to train
> <http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/uh-60.htm>Blackhawk helicopter
> pilots, along with other projects that help the U.S. military prepare for
> Iraq and <http://www.army.mil/vision/index.html>future combat missions.
> Some Linux and Free/Open Source developers
> <http://www.student.wau.nl/~olivier/antiwar/>may not support current U.S.
> military goals in the Middle East, but Awtrey does -- and for very
> personal reasons, as you'll see from his words, which NewsForge has edited
> (very lightly) only for grammar and clarity, not for content.
>
> Please note that Mr. Awtrey is speaking personally here rather than on
> behalf of I.D.E.A.L. Technologies. For more about what he and others have
> done with Open Source for the U.S. Department of Defense, please see this
> link: <http://linuxworld.idealcorp.com/>LinuxWorld Conference & Expo
> Presentation.
>
> NewsForge: Some Free Software and GPL supporters (and many coders) are
> virulently anti-war, and many are specifically against the U.S. invading
> Iraq. One well-regarded project, <http://bluefish.openoffice.nl>Bluefish,
> has a link on its site to an anti-war page. Could the use of popular GPL
> and Free Software packages in what many people overseas view as the "U.S.
> War Machine" cause strife and dissension among Free Software developers?
>
> Awtrey: I think the debate has caused strife and dissension in groups with
> less cohesion than Free Software / Open Source groups have. The chance of
> us avoiding some level of public debate on the issue seems unavoidable.
>
> The war issue has an amazing ability to polarize opinion. There are people
> with good hearts and good intentions on both sides. My wife was born in
> Iraq and her family moved here to escape Saddam and the Baath party 30
> years ago.
>
> This makes the issue especially touchy around here.
>
> She and her family hate Saddam. They have stories that would curl your
> toes about him and his psychopathic offspring Uday. It is not uncommon for
> people who make a quiet joke at a party on Friday to disappear with all
> their family, including cousins, before the weekend is over. They have no
> due process, they have no court to appeal to, the people are simply gone
> and never come back.
>
> NewsForge: I take it, then, that you and your wife have no problem with
> the U.S. invading Iraq?
>
> Awtrey: When people tell me that civilians will die in a war, I tell them
> that Saddam has already spilled more Iraqi blood than any aggressor. He is
> not a polite, reasonable man. He kills without thought. His son Uday rapes
> little girls and chops off the heads of prostitutes on the street.
>
> War or no war, this man needs killing like a rabid dog. And Iraq needs to
> be free.
>
> My wife, Hala, doesn't like George Bush Sr. or Jr. She remembers a time
> when George Bush Sr. was at the CIA and paid Saddam during the war with
> Iran. That war would be like a war between Florida and Georgia. Most of
> the actual people of the countries are related in some way. Politics
> aside, if there were a button she could push and kill just Saddam, she or
> any member of her family would push it. It's a hard decision when you know
> "the Iraqi people" as cousins, aunts, uncles, and have to risk them to
> save the country in the long term. She doesn't want her family hurt any
> more by anyone. Saddam is a little hurt every day, the war is a larger
> hurt, but likely a shorter period of time. The devil you know? The devil
> you don't?  It's a hard choice.
>
> NewsForge:The problem -- to some -- with GPL-licensed software is the fact
> that anyone can use it. How would you feel seeing some of your code used
> by Saddam Hussein's people. Or Osama bin Laden's? Or by the Chinese
> government to help prevent full Internet access?
>
> Awtrey: No clear opinions yet.
>
> I know there have been reports of them using PGP / GPG to encrypt
> messages.  That has to give Phil Zimmermann the shivers sometimes. One of
> the things life in America has taught me is that the words spoken by a
> racist skinhead are just as important as the words I speak. It doesn't
> mean I agree with them, it means that the right to speak is important, not
> what is said. If Free Software is about Free Speech, then we have to suck
> up the fact that people will use our code for things we don't agree with.
> I don't agree with drug use, but that doesn't stop drug dealers from using
> Apache or Mozilla or GPG. I can only state what I am for; peace, goodness,
> truth.
>
> I am with a crowd of people making statements. I hope that the sounds we
> make together are mostly peace, goodness, truth when heard by others, but
> all I can control is my own voice.
>
> w
>
>
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Adam Hyde
The Streaming Suitcase

Free as in 'media'

+44 (0)7919 847 023


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