[Nettime-bold] Re: Re[2]: <nettime> Adam Curry: Formats - We need them like we need a hole in the head

[josh zeidner <jjzeidner@yahoo.com>]

Hi Pit,

  I completely agree that distribution media like 12"
vinyl is still more robust and dynamic than something
like napster.  However, i think in all cases Napster
will breed a particular type of music, as will vinyl,
CDs, MTV etc( the media is the message ).  And I think
that the nature of napster will necessarily breed a
kind of music that is actually MORE commercial than
its radio, tv, or vinyl counterparts.  Why?  becuase
the methods of compensation are not supported at the
distributional level, the artist is forced to
incorporate a message or commercial about himself in
the actual recording.  Rap artists are the forerunners
of this type of music, as the early DJs and MCs were
faced with a similar problem as is encountered on
Napster.  Have you ever heard a rap song where the
artist repeatedly cites his own name, or that of his
group or record label?  welcome to the age of napster.

 thanks for the reply,
 
 josh

> Hello josh,
> 
> Wednesday, July 18, 2001, 7:29:57 PM, you wrote:
> 
> i'm not a friend of the order of genres either. but
> i do not think that this is what curry aims calling
> a format. when i go through a wood i don't think
> about the names of the trees.
> 
> a format is maybe something like "detroit techno"
> which is only becoming a genre in terms of
> a section in the archive, in a process of
> historification.
> in its strong time 10 years ago maybe it happened
> in a media network of social struggle, cars,
> futurism, electronics, radio stations, and
> a network of record collectors from diversive
> places as duesseldorf and brooklyn.
> 
> the problem with many of the p2p standards is that
> they look good on paper or they are brutally
> efficiant,
> but finally i prefer to get an account to
> a well sorted hotline server, and there we have
> the old bbs model (or format), or club model or
> label or dj. (certainly not the mediator, or
> explainer or online journalist ;))
> 
> it's always the social system which has to run
> a software, especially if it involves cultural
> content. its the conincidences of placement
> and displacement, like with the blue note label
> in jazz music. this *is* a format.
> 
> in case of fusion music, and fizzyfying subgenre
> microcosm of electronica. i like the idea
> of something simple and strong coming up
> from a place where you don't expect it,
> (like detroit techno 10 years ago mixing up
> with berlin and frankfurt techno etc. )
> 
> i think this post napster phase is very interesting
> not only in terms of net technology and
> copyright but how it builds new clouds of data,
> amalgames of production and distribution,
> something like the 12", the mix etc. is still
> dominated by the talk about technological standards.
> meanwhile the strenght of the ecology of small
> record labels lays in very intersting mixed
> economic models, including potlatch, collaborative
> filtering, remixing, open source, plagiarism etc
> etc. already.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jz>  I think Adam Curry is missing something here. 
> I
> jz> think the reason that Napster/Winamp( and all of
> its
> jz> ancillary systems like Freenet, etc ) became
> popular
> jz> because: music is free,jz> and you can get
> exactly what
> jz> you want without any commercials.  What Curry is
> jz> implying here is to apply Napster to the same
> model as
> jz> radio( with all the payola and what not ). 
> Sure, some
> jz> people will not notice the difference straight
> off,
> jz> but eventually, people will regard it as the
> same
> jz> thing as radio.  Ultimately, the great thing
> about
> jz> napster was that it levelled the playing field,
> and
> jz> people could easily and immediately download the
> music
> jz> from thier favorite artists, rather than
> subscribing
> jz> to particular 'genres' and allowing others to
> make
> jz> these decisions for them( namely, the music
> companies
> jz> ).  I dont think that I have to explain to the
> people
> jz> here is that the greatest artists are the ones
> that
> jz> ulitmately defy the genre definitions as made by
> the
> jz> music companies.
> 
> jz>  -josh z
> 
> 
> >> [hey mr dj. napster is going down, you might have
> >> expected it,
> >> but now what to do with the terabytes of mp3
> >> collections out
> >> there? maybe its not just about the data but your
> >> playlists...? /p]
> >> 
> 
> jz> #  distributed via <nettime>: no commercial use
> without permission
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> criticism,
> jz> #  collaborative text filtering and cultural
> politics of the nets
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> jz> #  archive: http://www.nettime.org contact:
> nettime@bbs.thing.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Best regards,
>  Pit                           
> mailto:pit@klubradio.de
> 
> 


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